SaveByRichter35 Posted November 3, 2019 Share Posted November 3, 2019 I'm aware of the OP's objections to the signing, I've seen his plethora of posts against it in other threads. While I agree it can get tiring reading it over and over again, its not as if his gripes are unfounded. We all know the Rangers have a rather large history of failed high profile UFA signings. Personally I was happy to see them sign Panarin but I can see why the OP has his doubts. There is nothing wrong with discussing that. There are plenty of dumb threads on here. If you are all so bothered by the OP and his gripes with the signing he just gave you the platform to make him eat crow when/if Panarin plays out his Ranger career like the Artemi Panarin of the Blackhawks and Blue Jackets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LindG1000 Posted November 3, 2019 Share Posted November 3, 2019 I'm aware of the OP's objections to the signing, I've seen his plethora of posts against it in other threads. While I agree it can get tiring reading it over and over again, its not as if his gripes are unfounded. We all know the Rangers have a rather large history of failed high profile UFA signings. Personally I was happy to see them sign Panarin but I can see why the OP has his doubts. There is nothing wrong with discussing that. There are plenty of dumb threads on here. If you are all so bothered by the OP and his gripes with the signing he just gave you the platform to make him eat crow when/if Panarin plays out his Ranger career like the Artemi Panarin of the Blackhawks and Blue Jackets. Has Artemi Panarin been anything less than advertised as a Ranger so far? He's billed as a shifty, skillful, point-per-game wing with a heck of a wrist shot. He's been exactly that. We're discussing this precisely because of the reasons RMC mentioned earlier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaveByRichter35 Posted November 3, 2019 Share Posted November 3, 2019 Has Artemi Panarin been anything less than advertised as a Ranger so far? He's billed as a shifty, skillful, point-per-game wing with a heck of a wrist shot. He's been exactly that. We're discussing this precisely because of the reasons RMC mentioned earlier. I'm not the one debating it. I am 100% happy with the signing. with that said, and I don't wanna sound like a Debby downer I am just playing devil's advocate from a neutral position, the argument can go both ways. It is only 10 games into the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatfrancesa Posted November 3, 2019 Author Share Posted November 3, 2019 Lot of talk here about me. I made this thread when the mods were complaining about the need for others to create threads for discussion. I believe the line was no thread is a stupid thread. If it is it will die naturally when nobody posts in it. So with that I made a thread about the highest paid best player in the team. A player who will be here for 7 years. You would think on a ranger forum a thread like that would have relevance. Instead at least one page of this thread has been used to discuss me or my intentions. Pathetic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatfrancesa Posted November 3, 2019 Author Share Posted November 3, 2019 And by the way panarin s personal performance is only one facet of determining whether it’s was worth it. His contract will have effects on this roster for years to come. Team success will ultimately be the determining factor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThirtyONE Posted November 3, 2019 Share Posted November 3, 2019 Oh please. You're not a victim. You asked a question and got an answer. Your opinion has been in the minority since July 1. It still is. That's all it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rizz GAWD Lav No Cap FrFr Posted November 3, 2019 Share Posted November 3, 2019 And by the way panarin s personal performance is only one facet of determining whether it?s was worth it. His contract will have effects on this roster for years to come. Team success will ultimately be the determining factor. If Panerin leads the league in scoring for a majority of this contract, is it not worth it? His personal performance is 100% a factor here. Big contracts are manageable when players live up to them, and that?s true here. Someone was going to get that contract on this team if it was successful, it just happened to be him. Panarin being a winger is immaterial if he has the ability to be more than just a goal scorer, which he has clearly shown. Playmaking wingers get paid too, which is why a guy like Marner got his contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangersIn7 Posted November 3, 2019 Share Posted November 3, 2019 Lot of talk here about me. I made this thread when the mods were complaining about the need for others to create threads for discussion. I believe the line was no thread is a stupid thread. If it is it will die naturally when nobody posts in it. So with that I made a thread about the highest paid best player in the team. A player who will be here for 7 years. You would think on a ranger forum a thread like that would have relevance. Instead at least one page of this thread has been used to discuss me or my intentions. Pathetic. And by the way panarin s personal performance is only one facet of determining whether it?s was worth it. His contract will have effects on this roster for years to come. Team success will ultimately be the determining factor. I generally like your posts but they are also consistently filled with contentiousness and refutation. Just pointing out facts Not starting shit It?s just an Internet forum about a hockey team. Really not that important Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted November 3, 2019 Share Posted November 3, 2019 Can the OP let us know what he considers "success"? Can't have the goalposts moving... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatfrancesa Posted November 3, 2019 Author Share Posted November 3, 2019 Oh please. You're not a victim. You asked a question and got an answer. Your opinion has been in the minority since July 1. It still is. That's all it is. Please what? Who said I was a victim? Fact is there are a lot of posts in this thread about me not the topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatfrancesa Posted November 3, 2019 Author Share Posted November 3, 2019 If Panerin leads the league in scoring for a majority of this contract, is it not worth it? His personal performance is 100% a factor here. Big contracts are manageable when players live up to them, and that’s true here. Someone was going to get that contract on this team if it was successful, it just happened to be him. Panarin being a winger is immaterial if he has the ability to be more than just a goal scorer, which he has clearly shown. Playmaking wingers get paid too, which is why a guy like Marner got his contract. Got it. I said his personal performance was s factor just not the only one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatfrancesa Posted November 3, 2019 Author Share Posted November 3, 2019 Can the OP let us know what he considers "success"? Can't have the goalposts moving... Am I that important? My entire stance was in the contex of the teams readiness for him and his contract. The first coupe of years are really not the ones I was worried about. In general I’d say I’m looking for 80 points a year personally for him Team success by year would change This year would be his impact on the younger guys and the team improving. Pretty low bar and I say he’s passing year 1 no problem Next year would be make the playoffs. Year three and on would be playoffs and advance a round. In total I would think a trip to the finals once in 7 years or 2 ecf would be fair. Also part of this is who are they unable to sign because of cap constraints. If panarin is personally living up to his 80 points then I would say no problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatfrancesa Posted November 3, 2019 Author Share Posted November 3, 2019 I generally like your posts but they are also consistently filled with contentiousness and refutation. Just pointing out facts Not starting shit It’s just an Internet forum about a hockey team. Really not that important Not sure how I’m the one being contentious or proving anyone wrong here. Would it be better if I just ask for people to stop posting about me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatfrancesa Posted November 3, 2019 Author Share Posted November 3, 2019 Can the OP let us know what he considers "success"? Can't have the goalposts moving... For that matter for anyone to have an opinion can they please post what 7 years of panarin success looks like. We cannot have the goal posts moving Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted November 3, 2019 Share Posted November 3, 2019 Am I that important? My entire stance was in the contex of the teams readiness for him and his contract. The first coupe of years are really not the ones I was worried about. In general I?d say I?m looking for 80 points a year personally for him Team success by year would change This year would be his impact on the younger guys and the team improving. Pretty low bar and I say he?s passing year 1 no problem Next year would be make the playoffs. Year three and on would be playoffs and advance a round. In total I would think a trip to the finals once in 7 years or 2 ecf would be fair. Also part of this is who are they unable to sign because of cap constraints. If panarin is personally living up to his 80 points then I would say no problem. Panarin is only responsible for his own play, not the team success. There are too many factors out of his control. If Panarin is a point per game player and everyone else sucks, how's it make him not worth it? He's doing his job. What if Gorton makes a ton of shitty trades? As far as who they retain or sign is too much of a moving target. They clearly can't resign ADA... But do they need to? And is that because of Panarin or the Shattenkirk buyout? Realistically if he pulls his own weight, that should be enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted November 3, 2019 Share Posted November 3, 2019 For that matter for anyone to have an opinion can they please post what 7 years of panarin success looks like. We cannot have the goal posts movingNah. You're the OP. It's up to you to get the guides for the thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatfrancesa Posted November 3, 2019 Author Share Posted November 3, 2019 Nah. You're the OP. It's up to you to get the guides for the thread. That’s weak. Panarin has been discussed in a lot of threads. People have their opinions. Team was always the argument against signing him. If it’s purely just a singular player performance standard. Then I would say he should rank in points where he ranks in salary league wide. That is fair and straightforward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted November 3, 2019 Share Posted November 3, 2019 That?s weak. Panarin has been discussed in a lot of threads. People have their opinions. Team was always the argument against signing him. If it?s purely just a singular player performance standard. Then I would say he should rank in points where he ranks in salary league wide. That is fair and straightforward.OK, that's fair. I'll say you should have posted your barometer in the OP rather than me having to ask. Also, like I said ... Who they retain is very much a subjective discussion. I don't care if they get rid of ADA because they can't afford him. They also don't need him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatfrancesa Posted November 3, 2019 Author Share Posted November 3, 2019 Panarin is only responsible for his own play, not the team success. There are too many factors out of his control. If Panarin is a point per game player and everyone else sucks, how's it make him not worth it? He's doing his job. What if Gorton makes a ton of shitty trades? As far as who they retain or sign is too much of a moving target. They clearly can't resign ADA... But do they need to? And is that because of Panarin or the Shattenkirk buyout? Realistically if he pulls his own weight, that should be enough. This is moving the goal posts from prior threads. It was about the team and their holes. It was about the rebuild and becoming a contender. How does the player who gets handed the largest contract very likely for a long time here not directly effect the success of the team? Surely he’s not the only factor but my point from the beginning that the team was full of holes and needed to wait to see what they needed. That was my point. Now you are saying if those holes don’t get filled and the team sucks it’s irrelevant? Panarin can live up to his contract yet not be worth it. It’s all about building a winner. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatfrancesa Posted November 3, 2019 Author Share Posted November 3, 2019 The entire conversation is subjective as is pretty much every conversation evaluating players and their value/worth. Value/Worth is tied to market and opportunity costs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lefty9 Posted November 3, 2019 Share Posted November 3, 2019 i could understand why Franny didnt like the signing ,the rangers team arent ready yet for a player with a huge contract,if they were a contending team then this signing would be a no brainer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LindG1000 Posted November 4, 2019 Share Posted November 4, 2019 The entire conversation is subjective as is pretty much every conversation evaluating players and their value/worth. No, it isn't. There are extremely objective ways to evaluate players, such as goals scored, or points, or how often that players team has the puck when he's on the ice. Saying that the whole thing is subjective is justifying troll threads like "Is Panarin worth the money after 7 games" or "Is our 2023 1st round pick worth trading for Connor McDavid?" Look, this is a bad thread centered around a flawed argument. You've even admitted it; just cut your losses and stop trying to have the argument for the sake of having the argument. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 Currently on pace for 47 goals and 94 points. Worth. Every. Penny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodka Drunkenski Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 He?s gooooooooood. I was hesitant about them signing him but so far he?s performed very well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4EverRangerFrank Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 Eye test? Panarin is worth every cent on pretty much every shift. He's not only creative, but he's like a roving puck magnet. The polar opposite thought is, "Where is Kreider?" When I think about these skilled guys, Panarin passes the eye test every game. Did K play in the CAR game? Not looking to derail the thread, just pointing out the value of Panarin from a person who would buy a ticket to the game -- he certainly gives you bang for the buck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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