Pete Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Rangers1994 said: Does Kane fill the team's greatest needs? No. You don't consider first line RW and 5v5 scoring a need? Edited June 25 by Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
torontonyr Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 38 minutes ago, Rangers1994 said: Does Kane fill the team's greatest needs? No. There's no magic button. You have to be pragmatic on some level 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 2 minutes ago, torontonyr said: There's no magic button. You have to be pragmatic on some level Correct. One player isn't going to fix everything that ails a team. However, I still can't understand how anyone can say swapping out Kakko/Wheeler/Roslovic for Kane isn't an improvement. This isn't rocket science. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooksBurner Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 Kane only makes sense if you trade Panarin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 (edited) 50 minutes ago, BrooksBurner said: Kane only makes sense if you trade Panarin And it's tired. Get a new schtick. Edited June 25 by Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooksBurner Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 1 minute ago, Pete said: And it's tired. Get a new schtick. My preferred path is to trade Kreider and Igor to start loading up for the next 8 years of the franchise, so I don’t know what you’re going on about. You can keep Panarin and sign Kane in that scenario, and I wouldn’t care as long as the cap mess is cleaned up in two years. Cuylle-Zibanejad-Kane Panarin-Trocheck-Lafreniere Knock yourself out bud Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangersIn7 Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 39 minutes ago, BrooksBurner said: My preferred path is to trade Kreider and Igor to start loading up for the next 8 years of the franchise, so I don’t know what you’re going on about. You can keep Panarin and sign Kane in that scenario, and I wouldn’t care as long as the cap mess is cleaned up in two years. Cuylle-Zibanejad-Kane Panarin-Trocheck-Lafreniere Knock yourself out bud If that’s you’re preferred path, why not just move everyone? Push the reset button. Unload everyone and start fresh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichieNextel305 Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 (edited) There is no team and no GM alive that would look at the Rangers franchise, point at it, and say it “now that’s a team that needs to hit the reset button.” I’m not knocking your opinion. Everyone is entitled to one. But I just don’t see the logic. It’s too video game-ish to me. Three straight 100 point seasons. Two ECF trips. A roster where being 32 or 33 is “old.” A win-now coach. Arguably the best goalie in the sport. They may very well need to rock the bot a bit. And Drury may do that in the next few days. But they also need some help around the edges. And just because every guy isn’t 24 years old that their name is attached to, just because they are looking at veterans, doesn’t make it the wrong approach. Edited June 25 by RichieNextel305 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooksBurner Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 16 minutes ago, RangersIn7 said: If that’s you’re preferred path, why not just move everyone? Push the reset button. Unload everyone and start fresh. Move everyone like who? The two guys with NMCs who everyone says won't waive? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooksBurner Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 5 minutes ago, RichieNextel305 said: There is no team and no GM alive that would look at the Rangers franchise, point at it, and say it “now that’s a team that needs to hit the reset button.” I’m not knocking your opinion. Everyone is entitled to one. But I just don’t see the logic. It’s too video game-ish to me. Three straight 100 point seasons. Two ECF trips. A roster where being 32 or 33 is “old.” A win-now coach. Arguably the best goalie in the sport. They may very well need to rock the bot a bit. And Drury may do that in the next few days. But they also need some help around the edges. And just because every guy isn’t 24 years old that their name is attached to, just because they are looking at veterans, doesn’t make it the wrong approach. Correct, but hitting the reset button is not at all my opinion. It's a step back refactor, and you're going to have to do that in the next year or two whether you like it or not, because the top guys are getting older and contracts will be expiring. They aren't stripping it all down to tank, nobody is suggesting that. They have a couple of guys in Kreider and Igor who they can sell high to do a short term step back refactor. There's a good framework of 26 and under players and soon-to-be-here prospects. Go take a look at the Igor thread and count up the guys saying they wouldn't pay him. If you're not paying him, there's two options: trade or use for one more year in an all or nothing year and let him walk in UFA for nothing. The latter is one expensive one year rental. I'm sorry, but anyone who is in the "don't pay Igor" camp is supporting exactly what I'm supporting. That's a step back refactor as soon as you don't pay that man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichieNextel305 Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 11 minutes ago, BrooksBurner said: Correct, but hitting the reset button is not at all my opinion. It's a step back refactor, and you're going to have to do that in the next year or two whether you like it or not, because the top guys are getting older and contracts will be expiring. They aren't stripping it all down to tank, nobody is suggesting that. They have a couple of guys in Kreider and Igor who they can sell high to do a short term step back refactor. There's a good framework of 26 and under players and soon-to-be-here prospects. Go take a look at the Igor thread and count up the guys saying they wouldn't pay him. If you're not paying him, there's two options: trade or use for one more year in an all or nothing year and let him walk in UFA for nothing. The latter is one expensive one year rental. I'm sorry, but anyone who is in the "don't pay Igor" camp is supporting exactly what I'm supporting. That's a step back refactor as soon as you don't pay that man. I’m of the genuine belief there is no way they let him walk. You just have to hope Drury and his agent find middle ground. He is going to get paid. But keeping it around $9-10 Million would be huge. I don’t see a full reset happening. They’re there. They are going to have their cracks at this again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooksBurner Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 8 minutes ago, RichieNextel305 said: I’m of the genuine belief there is no way they let him walk. You just have to hope Drury and his agent find middle ground. He is going to get paid. But keeping it around $9-10 Million would be huge. I don’t see a full reset happening. They’re there. They are going to have their cracks at this again. Well I agree, I think what a lot of people here would do with Igor is not what Drury will do. My guess on the most likely outcome is that Drury will re-sign him at around 11.5. Yes. I am also pretty sure we'll get another crack at the playoffs with Igor trying to carry a mediocre 5v5 team that can't forecheck on his back again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichieNextel305 Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 2 minutes ago, BrooksBurner said: Well I agree, I think what a lot of people here would do with Igor is not what Drury will do. My guess on the most likely outcome is that Drury will re-sign him at around 11.5. Yes. I am also pretty sure we'll get another crack at the playoffs with Igor trying to carry a mediocre 5v5 team that can't forecheck on his back again. I think this stigma about the Rangers being PP merchants and mediocre 5v5 is a false narrative. Yes, their PP was very effective. And yes, some of their top guys need to be better 5v5. Namely Zibanejad and Kreider, and especially if they want to remain together. But the Rangers finished 10th at ES goals for, ahead of teams like Boston, Carolina and Florida in that regard. Their goal differential at even strength was 52, finishing them at 7th in that regard. So again, I don’t know how you can technically be called a bad team at even strength if you’re in the Top-10 in goals for and goal differential. And you can’t just thank Igor for that, because he did go stretches of this past season where he looked lost. Again, I just find it to be a false narrative based solely off of the fact that Zibanejad and Kreider need to be better 5v5. It’s not a team wide dilemma. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangersIn7 Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 41 minutes ago, BrooksBurner said: Move everyone like who? The two guys with NMCs who everyone says won't waive? If you’re going full rebuild… You move your biggest assets first. That means: Igor Fox Lafreniere CK20 Followed by: Panarin Mika Trouba If you have to package to do it, you do it. Im not advocating this and they aren’t doing it, but it’s at least a basic and simple blueprint as to how you might do it. You can take a big salary back in 1 of those deals if you have to as long as it’s not backbreaking. You go for futures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangersIn7 Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 (edited) 5 minutes ago, RichieNextel305 said: I think this stigma about the Rangers being PP merchants and mediocre 5v5 is a false narrative. Yes, their PP was very effective. And yes, some of their top guys need to be better 5v5. Namely Zibanejad and Kreider, and especially if they want to remain together. But the Rangers finished 10th at ES goals for, ahead of teams like Boston, Carolina and Florida in that regard. Their goal differential at even strength was 52, finishing them at 7th in that regard. So again, I don’t know how you can technically be called a bad team at even strength if you’re in the Top-10 in goals for and goal differential. And you can’t just thank Igor for that, because he did go stretches of this past season where he looked lost. Again, I just find it to be a false narrative based solely off of the fact that Zibanejad and Kreider need to be better 5v5. It’s not a team wide dilemma. They need to get slightly better at 5v5 We all know that. But here’s what we are missing. We are putting all of that lesser 5v5 production on Zib and CK. Its not just them. That line needs to be better. But the 3rd line needs to be better at ES too. Not having Chytil and Kakko being hurt last year for an extended period of time hurt them a lot at ES. The 3rd line was very good defensively. But they got caved in too much cause there wasn’t enough offensive talent there, they didn’t generate enough shots and chances, and basically shook out to roughly neutral hockey while being hemmed in. That’s a huge factor. Get better there. Edited June 25 by RangersIn7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooksBurner Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 (edited) 6 minutes ago, RangersIn7 said: If you’re going full rebuild… You move your biggest assets first. That means: Igor Fox Lafreniere CK20 Followed by: Panarin Mika Trouba If you have to package to do it, you do it. Im not advocating this and they aren’t doing it, but it’s at least a basic and simple blueprint as to how you might do it. You can take a big salary back in 1 of those deals if you have to as long as it’s not backbreaking. You go for futures. Oh nah. Not interested in that. Fox and Lafreniere are the cornerstones to invest in. I'd be looking to use Igor/Kreider to get young 20s players or good NHL ready prospects. I'm not all that interested in picks. The beauty of it is that Zibanejad and Panarin probably still keep the team competitive and in playoff contention. That's important for morale on a refactor. Edited June 25 by BrooksBurner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangersIn7 Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 2 minutes ago, BrooksBurner said: Oh nah. Not interested in that. Fox and Lafreniere are the cornerstones to invest in. I'd be looking to use Igor/Kreider to get young 20s players or good NHL ready prospects. I'm not all that interested in picks. The beauty of it is that Zibanejad and Panarin probably still keep the team competitive and in playoff contention. That's important for morale on a refactor. Yeah I get that mentality, and it’s not a bad one. Its personal bias for me though. If you’re torching the barn, then completely empty it first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangersIn7 Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 3 minutes ago, BrooksBurner said: Oh nah. Not interested in that. Fox and Lafreniere are the cornerstones to invest in. I'd be looking to use Igor/Kreider to get young 20s players or good NHL ready prospects. I'm not all that interested in picks. The beauty of it is that Zibanejad and Panarin probably still keep the team competitive and in playoff contention. That's important for morale on a refactor. We are both though wasting our time even talking about it. It isn’t happening. Nor should it. They are really close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooksBurner Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 (edited) 14 minutes ago, RichieNextel305 said: I think this stigma about the Rangers being PP merchants and mediocre 5v5 is a false narrative. Yes, their PP was very effective. And yes, some of their top guys need to be better 5v5. Namely Zibanejad and Kreider, and especially if they want to remain together. But the Rangers finished 10th at ES goals for, ahead of teams like Boston, Carolina and Florida in that regard. Their goal differential at even strength was 52, finishing them at 7th in that regard. So again, I don’t know how you can technically be called a bad team at even strength if you’re in the Top-10 in goals for and goal differential. And you can’t just thank Igor for that, because he did go stretches of this past season where he looked lost. Again, I just find it to be a false narrative based solely off of the fact that Zibanejad and Kreider need to be better 5v5. It’s not a team wide dilemma. In the playoffs, the Rangers were 9th in 5v5 GF/60 and 7th in GA/60 despite having the best goalie on the planet. They were 15th in xGF/60 and 13th in xGA/60. They were 14th in HDCF/60 and 15th in HDCA/60. They were 2nd in PDO and SV%. Edited June 25 by BrooksBurner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichieNextel305 Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooksBurner Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 Re-sign in Detroit Kaner. The Rangers can trade Panarin to play with you. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deejaid Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 4 hours ago, BrooksBurner said: Kane only makes sense if you trade Panarin I’d say Kane only makes sense because of Panarin, and not because of their past history. We have two more years of Panarin under contract, and with him turning 33 in October, you could argue, two more years of his prime. With Kreids and Mika also now in their early 30’s, the window to win with this core is probably 2 more years. Kane coming in on a two year deal aligns with this cores window, if they don’t get it done, both Kane and Panarin will be off the books after the 25-26 season, just in time to take a run at McDavid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichieNextel305 Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 Kane makes sense because Zibanejad needs to become a shooter again. And because he put up almost a PPG last year. And because the RW on that line has been a gaping hole. And because he will probably come cheap and our cap space at the moment isn’t that large. 1 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Br4d Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 1 hour ago, BrooksBurner said: Re-sign in Detroit Kaner. The Rangers can trade Panarin to play with you. Or go to Chicago as the Blackhawks make several moves with all that cap space to keep Bedard from being the only target all next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzy Posted June 25 Share Posted June 25 22 minutes ago, RichieNextel305 said: Kane makes sense because Zibanejad needs to become a shooter again. And because he put up almost a PPG last year. And because the RW on that line has been a gaping hole. And because he will probably come cheap and our cap space at the moment isn’t that large. Just keep a rollin' here Richie! I'm a jumpin' on board, and let you do you drive the ship home here! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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