Mercogliano Can the Rangers Win a Stanley Cup With Mika Zibanejad as Their Top Center?

[Mistercosmic]

This question instantly reminded me of Zibanejad's awful OT turnover in Game 4 of the ECF, which led to the Panthers getting a PP and eventually scoring. It's not just the lack of production but mistakes like these that create the negative narrative surrounding him. He regularly doesn't perform his best hockey during the playoffs as a true 1C should. 

[Albatrosss]

Just now, Mistercosmic said:

This question instantly reminded me of Zibanejad's awful OT turnover in Game 4 of the ECF, which led to the Panthers getting a PP and eventually scoring. It's not just the lack of production but mistakes like these that create the negative narrative surrounding him. He regularly doesn't perform his best hockey during the playoffs as a true 1C should. 

Lots of times his playmaking skills totally disappear. Unless its a 2-on-1 i dont want him carrying the puck. Its almost always a turnover 

[Br4d]

2 years ago Zib was a #1 Center albeit not in the top tier.

 

He's not a #1 Center at this point and the idea that this is on his linemates is kind of crazy.  A #1 Center makes his linemates better.

 

The decline started in '22-23 when his scoring at even strength against the better teams declined.  Last season his EVS scoring declined vs everybody.

[Vodka Drunkenski]

7 hours ago, BrooksBurner said:

 

Do you think he'll rank 8th over the next 5 years?

It’s possible, we don’t know what kind of player he is playing without Kreider.  I’m willing to give him a chance to see

[Vodka Drunkenski]

1 hour ago, Br4d said:

2 years ago Zib was a #1 Center albeit not in the top tier.

 

He's not a #1 Center at this point and the idea that this is on his linemates is kind of crazy.  A #1 Center makes his linemates better.

 

The decline started in '22-23 when his scoring at even strength against the better teams declined.  Last season his EVS scoring declined vs everybody.

So his best season since 19/20 is when his the decline started, interesting 

 

21/22 - 81GP, 49 EV
22/23 - 82GP, 50 EV

23/24 - 81GP, 45 EV

 

Huge step down

Edited June 14 by Vodka Drunkenski

[phillyb]

I think both Zib and Tro are great second line centers. 

[BreakawayMachine]

Short answer: Nope

 

Long answer: Noooooooooope

[BrooksBurner]

41 minutes ago, Vodka Drunkenski said:

So his best season since 19/20 is when his the decline started, interesting 

 

21/22 - 81GP, 49 EV
22/23 - 82GP, 50 EV

23/24 - 81GP, 45 EV

 

Huge step down

35*

[Pete]

Lots of people hung on on the wrong question.

 

Zib is without a doubt a 1C.

 

Can they win with him? If they get him a productive RW and a LW that's not a parasite, sure. 

[Valriera]

Zib is a fine 1C. It's unfair to compare him to Alexander Barkov, who is currently doing to Connor McDavid, the best player of the last twenty years, what he did to Mika. I think he's probably pretty underpaid all things considered.

 

But that doesn't mean this guy is a championship player. Look at him, how he plays, and how he talks, and tell me with a straight face that this is who you want rolling out against Connor McDavid in the Stanley Cup Finals. Noooooooope. No thanks. 

 

That player is hard to find though. And the player we have is Zib. So the only logical move here is to get him a pair of wings that can do better than the obvious dumpster fire he has, and hope he works it out. 

 

But seriously, the recent history comparisons against Barkov are not fair. I've now watched this guy closely for two series. He's better than every skater in the league by a country mile, McDavid included. Literally takes zero strides off, he's impossible to play defense against, and impossible to play offense against. Ferraro used the phrase Kopitar in his prime who was the same way - Barkov is way better. Just a freak of a player. Let's not be unfair to Mika who will never be that good. Barkovs don't grow on trees, but fast, physical wingers do. 

[jsm7302]

17 minutes ago, phillyb said:

I think both Zib and Tro are great second line centers. 

Package one for a top tier #1? Talk about changing the dynamic... because we know it ain't Tro that would be shopped. 

[Sharpshooter]

I think they just really need a top RW to play with him and that will really help. However, I still have issues with him in the sense of what's happening between the ears. He'll look amazing for a couple of weeks, then totally invisible the next. He goes too long being a complete non factor and it's annoying. I've alwys thought he was bi-polar or something, and I'm not even joking. He's not engaged nearly enough.

[Pete]

10 minutes ago, Valriera said:

Zib is a fine 1C. It's unfair to compare him to Alexander Barkov, who is currently doing to Connor McDavid, the best player of the last twenty years, what he did to Mika. I think he's probably pretty underpaid all things considered.

 

But that doesn't mean this guy is a championship player. Look at him, how he plays, and how he talks, and tell me with a straight face that this is who you want rolling out against Connor McDavid in the Stanley Cup Finals. Noooooooope. No thanks. 

 

That player is hard to find though. And the player we have is Zib. So the only logical move here is to get him a pair of wings that can do better than the obvious dumpster fire he has, and hope he works it out. 

 

But seriously, the recent history comparisons against Barkov are not fair. I've now watched this guy closely for two series. He's better than every skater in the league by a country mile, McDavid included. Literally takes zero strides off, he's impossible to play defense against, and impossible to play offense against. Ferraro used the phrase Kopitar in his prime who was the same way - Barkov is way better. Just a freak of a player. Let's not be unfair to Mika who will never be that good. Barkovs don't grow on trees, but fast, physical wingers do. 

Agree with a lot of this, but don't forget Zib also shut down Barkov offensively that series. 

[Sharpshooter]

Yeah, I do think Mika's defensive play may go underappreciated at times, or not even really noticed at all. In the playoffs, you have top guys shutting down other top guys. It happens often where some guys just cancel each other out almost.

[Valriera]

7 minutes ago, Pete said:

Agree with a lot of this, but don't forget Zib also shut down Barkov offensively that series. 

Idk I credit Igor for that more than anything. Too many high quality chances against head to head. But regardless Mika in his own zone looks similar to McDavid in his own zone right now so I think it’s probably the case that barkov is just an alien and unfair comparison point 

[Pete]

2 minutes ago, Valriera said:

Idk I credit Igor for that more than anything. Too many high quality chances against head to head. But regardless Mika in his own zone looks similar to McDavid in his own zone right now so I think it’s probably the case that barkov is just an alien and unfair comparison point 

I can see that.

 

I also think that a lot of people here would complain about Barkov if they watched him for 82 games.

[Br4d]

27 minutes ago, Valriera said:

Zib is a fine 1C. It's unfair to compare him to Alexander Barkov, who is currently doing to Connor McDavid, the best player of the last twenty years, what he did to Mika. I think he's probably pretty underpaid all things considered.

 

But that doesn't mean this guy is a championship player. Look at him, how he plays, and how he talks, and tell me with a straight face that this is who you want rolling out against Connor McDavid in the Stanley Cup Finals. Noooooooope. No thanks. 

 

That player is hard to find though. And the player we have is Zib. So the only logical move here is to get him a pair of wings that can do better than the obvious dumpster fire he has, and hope he works it out. 

 

But seriously, the recent history comparisons against Barkov are not fair. I've now watched this guy closely for two series. He's better than every skater in the league by a country mile, McDavid included. Literally takes zero strides off, he's impossible to play defense against, and impossible to play offense against. Ferraro used the phrase Kopitar in his prime who was the same way - Barkov is way better. Just a freak of a player. Let's not be unfair to Mika who will never be that good. Barkovs don't grow on trees, but fast, physical wingers do. 

 

Barkov is 28 and Mika is 31.  That's a huge difference in competitive sports.

[RJWantsTheCup]

I think Rangers fans are a unique fanbase.  We almost don't seem happy unless we are complaining about something.  Sometimes the complaints are justified and most of the times they are just reaching for something to complain about.   

[Sharpshooter]

Just now, Br4d said:

 

Barkov is 28 and Mika is 31.  That's a huge difference in competitive sports.

Yeah, that is another concern of mine. Mika is only going to get worse from here, not better. I still think he's got some good years left, but there are definitely more behind him than ahead of him.

[Pete]

1 minute ago, Sharpshooter said:

Yeah, that is another concern of mine. Mika is only going to get worse from here, not better. I still think he's got some good years left, but there are definitely more behind him than ahead of him.

Barkov will turn 29 shortly and Mika just turned 31. It's not that big a difference. 

 

And I don't really know what that has to do with the conversation.

[BrooksBurner]

19 minutes ago, Pete said:

Agree with a lot of this, but don't forget Zib also shut down Barkov offensively that series. 

No he didn’t. Igor did. Big difference.

[Sharpshooter]

Just now, Pete said:

Barkov will turn 29 shortly and Mika just turned 31. It's not that big a difference. 

 

And I don't really know what that has to do with the conversation.

It has nothing to do with the conversation, correct.

[Vodka Drunkenski]

43 minutes ago, BrooksBurner said:

35*

apparently my math sucks

[BrooksBurner]

Just now, Vodka Drunkenski said:

apparently my math sucks

@RichieNextel305 math

[Pete]

4 minutes ago, BrooksBurner said:

No he didn’t. Igor did. Big difference.

I'm sure that's the way you see it.